EPISODE TRANSCRIPT
Intro
If you’re running a software development agency, it shouldn’t be too hard to grow. Welcome to Managed Coder Podcast. Tune in every week to find out how to grow your software development agency and help you to solve your day-to-day problems with 20 plus years’ experience running an agency. Please welcome your host, Shahed Islam.
Shahed Islam:
Hey Najm, welcome. Glad to be part of this discussion here. Introduce yourself a little bit.
Najm:
Thank you, Shahed. Hi, everybody. My name is Najm, I’m a marketing consultant. For the past four years, I have been doing is I’ve been helping agencies build their own marketing department. So, I basically do anything and everything that has to do with bringing in more clients for B2B agencies.
Shahed Islam:
Thank you, Najm. So, I’ve been running an agency for 17 years and I’ll be very honest, I wish I knew you a long time back. We struggled a lot with marketing. People always think that marketing is not needed by an agency. But I have realized lately that it is a very important factor. So, one of the areas, which you and I talked about earlier, and many times, you’ve been consulting us for a long time about inbound marketing. When I talk to other agencies where they’ve been doing business, they get clients, what is inbound marketing? Why it is important for agencies?
Najm:
So, there are other companies, people can Google inbound marketing and they can get a really good idea about it. But one thing I should point out, inbound marketing is all about putting resources out there, putting content out there so that clients come to you. So, educate clients enough anywhere and everywhere possible so that they understand that you can add value to their company, and they would love to speak with you. So, less of us going to the client. It’s more of clients would just come to us. That’s the main methodology of inbound marketing.
Shahed Islam:
One problem I see with our software development agency, the C level executives, they think that they get some referrals, they are getting some business, and up to a level you can do that but after that, if you don’t do … but the other problem I see with inbound marketing, some people expect results quickly. How long does it take to get results on inbound marketing?
Najm:
That’s a fantastic question. Inbound Marketing takes a long time to get resolved. So, inbound marketing is one of those things that it’s going to take some time for you to get used to it. It’s going to take some time for the team to get used to it, and to put the really good content out there where your clients would be interested to get in touch with you but it takes a lot more time than outbound marketing. But the good side of inbound marketing is that once it gets started, once you start [unintelligible 02:54] coming in, once it starts working, it becomes very sustainable. You don’t have to worry a lot. So, it’s where we talk about the shelf life of content. So, if you think about the content for inbound marketing, the shelf life of that content is very long. By that what I mean is, it’s not going to be where you just stop marketing and [unintelligible 03:21] stop coming. Inbound Marketing is one of those philosophies that you can implement, or anybody can implement, where you build a sustainable marketing engine so that clients keep coming in over and over again. It’s a fantastic system that anybody can follow.
Shahed Islam:
So in simple terms, if I were starting an inbound for an agency, what are the three things I should do?
Najm:
So, first thing first, we need to understand who our clients are. That’s the first thing we need to understand. Because whatever I suggest that my clients do is, the first thing we will try to understand who are our clients. And depends on the kind of agency you are in, what are your USPs, and what are the services you’re providing. So, that’s the first thing we should be doing, understanding our clients. Now, I do need to get a little deep into this because it’s very important. So, understanding clients doesn’t necessarily mean us thinking that, okay, this is my client. That’s not it. In my opinion, you should definitely write down exactly who you think your clients are. But at the same time, you should interview your existing customers and get some more information out of them. For example, after they have become your client, and if they had been your client for the last six months or six years, if you ask them, hey, we have other companies out there who are like me but why are you still with me? You get such a really good insight from that question it’s amazing. So, that’s the first thing we need to do. We need to understand who are our target clients. So that’s one. Then we need to understand what are the problems that they are facing and what kind of content we can produce so that they understand that we can add value to their life. So, everybody loves free things, and everybody loves free knowledge, especially in this day and age. So, if you can produce content where it will help them a little bit, at the same time, they will also understand that you know the industry, you know their pain point. So, you solve their pain point with one kind of content, one piece of content. And they will understand. If they understand this basic problem that I have they might be able to help us a little more. And that’s how they will start communicating with you, they will start interacting with you on social or other platforms where you’re producing content. And one day you will see them getting in touch with you because they will feel that they are getting enough value and I believe that they can do it more if I just hired them as a vendor.
Shahed Islam:
And it shows that we are experts in that field, right?
Najm:
Absolutely. That’s the goal, yes.
Shahed Islam:
To the buyer persona, which you talked about, we need to analyze and ask them questions and get the buyer persona. And the second thing you’re saying creating content on the website. [Unintelligible 06:15] you and I talked about social media, in a way inbound marketing, the third part. Why social media is important for B2B agencies like us? Because sometimes I used to feel like oh, it is not needed, the client wouldn’t know. But why is it important? What do you want to tell agency owners to do about social media?
Najm:
So, what I would suggest is, at the end of the day, this is one of those things where 10 years ago, 15 years ago, people said, hey, social media is for young people, now everybody is using it. Then after five years, people said, hey, social media is only for B2C, it’s not for B2B. And then now everybody is using, it doesn’t matter if it’s B2B or B2C. And still, now, we have companies or agencies who would say, I don’t know if social media will really help us and I don’t know if this will really generate clients. But there are agencies who are out there that are doing a fantastic job. So, what can agencies do on social media? The number one thing that I can say or suggest is that focus on quality and not quantity. And again, I’m just specifically talking about B2B agencies. So, there it’s all about quantity. It’s not going to be more about producing seven pieces of content for seven days. Except for that, if you think about producing one really good piece of content. And that content can be anything. It can be a small podcast that can be a quick video that can be really interesting images as well, right? But the piece of content needs to have quality. So that either it entertains your clients depends on what kind of channels you’re putting out. So, if it is an entertainment channel, it definitely needs to entertain the client. And if it is a platform where people go and try to learn something, for example, YouTube. People will go on YouTube and search how to do this or how to do that. There are people who want a lot more educational content. So, if B2B agencies put out content where they actually maintain the quality, it has always worked. I have seen this over and over again with my clients or with other agencies that we also follow to see what they’re doing. It has always worked, whereas if you focus on quality it’s just working in 2022.
Shahed Islam:
That’s a very good idea. One thing I have noticed is that when I am talking and closing a bigger deal, the client does go to your social media and want to see the feel of it. So that means that your social media can be a place where you represent your culture and your team members.
Najm:
Yes, absolutely. Thank you so much for pointing that out. That’s what I was about to add. In social media, especially for B2B agencies, your clients would love to see the kind of culture that you have internally. If you think about hey, what kind of content should I be producing, of course, you can do your own analysis, and you can come up with your own strategy. But the easiest thing that you can do is just portray your own culture that you have inside your own company or agency. And I believe true agencies definitely take care of their employees, they follow a lot of processes. Just put those things out there. We don’t necessarily have to create. We can literally document what is already going on. And that can actually become really good content.
Shahed Islam:
So, in my discussion with different agency owners, one problem I see is that they do not see any views or likes on their posts and they stop it. They say there is no value. But I actually do not think it’s a good idea. Consistency with your time. Let’s say you can make a deal of $1 million, or $100,000 and that could be the post you made. They saw it, and that will influence them. That’s branding, social media that is.
Najm:
Absolutely. And the other thing is, that we need to understand how we’re using social media. So, I’ll ask you, if you use Facebook, often, you scroll a lot, and maybe you see something and you stop but do not necessarily always like it, or give some kind of reaction or comment. Is that not right? So, our way of interacting with these platforms has changed a lot. So, even if somebody is not reacting to the post that you’re doing right now that does not necessarily mean people are not interested. So, we have to understand how these platforms are evolving and we just need to adapt to them. That’s it. So, the metrics that used to be okay, where we used to look for likes, shares, and comments, those things are changing a lot more. Now, people interact a lot less with posts but there are times when they just want to see what you’re doing and understand what you’re doing. And maybe take action, not on social media but on your website. But the social media posts that you’re making right now will create a really good impression in their minds about your brand.
Shahed Islam:
So, in a typical agency like B2B companies, what kind of budget, we talked about it before. I will be very honest that when I talk to people they think that marketing for agencies is a waste of money. But you are very determined. You have a strong opinion that a certain amount of budget should be spent. We spend on sales teams a lot but we don’t spend on marketing. And then that’s how we don’t get closed deals or get more leads. So what is the ratio? Do you have any suggestions for anyone who is listening to this?
Najm:
Absolutely. I do have the ratio. But even before that, I want to point something out. Most of the agency owners, if I’m not wrong they’re not marketers. Maybe they are from other backgrounds. Maybe they are engineers. [Crosstalk 12:24]. So, if they were engineers I honestly don’t blame them anymore. I used to think, hey, why are they thinking like this? Why would they not understand that they need to invest in marketing? Now, I understand that it’s not their fault because they have never thought of it that way. So now, it’s our job to explain it to them. So now let me explain. It is just like how you need coders, and they will be developing software. It is just like how you need machinery to produce T-Shirts. For example, if you have a T-shirt Company, you need some machinery and you need some people who will be continuously producing T-Shirts. The same goes for software, or the same goes for apps. You need people to continuously code and do a lot of other things like quality assurance, UI UX, and all of that to produce software. Marketing is exactly the same. It does not happen just like that. It does not happen by us only thinking about it. Marketing needs investment just like any other department. Marketing is really good people. And when you give those people really good tools magic happens. But if you ask me, hey, so what’s first, chicken or egg? I would say, it’s the investment, it has always been an investment. It doesn’t matter which department we are talking about. For marketing, especially, we have to invest first. Now, of course, we need to invest smartly. And that’s a whole different ballgame. And that’s a whole different conversation that we can have another day. How do you determine how much we need to spend and where do we spend it. But if there was one very quick piece of information that I can give based on the analysis that has been done on B2B agencies, they say at least 8% should be your marketing budget. That’s like the minimum marketing budget that you should have for digital marketing. And that’s not my research. That’s the other agencies, who have actually worked with more than 1000 companies and they have come up with this number. So, that’s the research that has been done on a lot of people. But on top of that, here’s my opinion. My opinion is to ask yourself how much money are you willing to spend per client. Ask yourself how much money are you willing to spend per client. Now, only multiply it by the number that you have in mind, these are how many clients I want within this year. That’s the simplest method that you can do. If I say it’s going to cost me $1 per client, and I say I want 100 clients, you better have at least $100 in your pocket. Otherwise, it is just well wishes. Otherwise, it’s just I’m thinking that I want those clients but I want to invest that money. So that’s the easiest math. How much do I want to spend per client? How much am I working with spending per client? And how many clients do I want and just multiply? That’s the easiest math.
Shahed Islam:
Thank you, Najm. The way you explain things is very simple and that’s why we’ve been working with you for so long. We ran out of time but it looks like we have a lot of things to discuss so I’m going to welcome you back very soon. I would like to know, the last note, if somebody wants to reach out to you if they’re a B2B agency or a software development agency, how do they contact you? What is the best way? I know you have some consulting agreements with other agencies.
Najm:
Absolutely. They can just Google my name right now. It’s on the screen. Najm Consultant. They can just Google and they’ll see my website. The website is najmc.com and they will see all the information there. I’m very transparent. All my services are there, the prices are there so they can just see exactly what I do. And they can get in touch with me from the website.
Shahed Islam:
Thank you, Najm. Very nice talking to you and we’ll welcome you back pretty soon. Thank you.
Najm:
Thank you so much for having me.
Outro
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